Provisional Patent Application question PART 2

[ideaboy]

1. What if I don't come up with the actual patent within 12 months from provisional patent application date?
1a. I know I will have to complete actual patent application. How much money will I loose during the non-provisional patent application process?
1b. Assume I don't have the actual product within the 12 month period and I end up paying the fee associated with the non-provisional application. What next? Can I still work on my idea?
1c. Is there any limitation on the number of provisional patents I can file for the same idea (please address both the cases : 1. before 12 months window, and 2: after I have crossed the 12 months period)

[Brad]

1)  If you do not file the full non-provisional application within 12 months then your provisional application will expire and you will lose that early filing date.

1a) I hate to use the term "lose" money.  Patent expenses should be an investment (a risky one).  If those risky investments are not worth while or you don't see the value it them, then it may not make sense to file a patent.  Patent decisions should be a business strategy decision not something a lawyer talks you into.  The average cost for a full non-provisional application is $4000-$8000 for a simple invention and it can get much higher than that for software and complex inventions.

1b) If you have a full non-provisional patent or patent application you can license or sell that patent even if you don't have a product on the market yet. 

1c) You can file unlimited provisional patent applications until either you (or someone else) publicly discloses the invention or offers it for sale.  As long as you keep your idea secret, in theory you can keep re-filing provisional applications but this is risky because your competition may sneak a patent filing in and then at some point their patent will pre-date yours because each provisional application that you file will get its own filing date (you cannot link them together).

Hope that helps.

[ideaboy]

Thanks! a few more questions:

1)  If you do not file the full non-provisional application within 12 months then your provisional application will expire and you will lose that early filing date.

I will lose my early filing date and that's it; there will be no additional money out of my pocket ?

1a) I hate to use the term "lose" money.  Patent expenses should be an investment (a risky one).  If those risky investments are not worth while or you don't see the value it them, then it may not make sense to file a patent.  Patent decisions should be a business strategy decision not something a lawyer talks you into.  The average cost for a full non-provisional application is $4000-$8000 for a simple invention and it can get much higher than that for software and complex inventions.

I think I used the term "lose" because of the following reasons:
1. I am not sure of the entire patent application process and the fees associated with each step of the process
2. I am not sure of the steps I need to take - and I don't have answers to questions such as "how do I know if my idea is unique?" - before filing a provisional patent application

If I know my idea is unique, I will go ahead with the patent application with full force, and I might have to hire a professional to assist me during the process.

Coming back to my question, I need to pay the non-provisional application fee only if I decide to go through the non-provisional application process right? And, I can decide to leave my idea and my patent journey without any penalties (financial) at the end of the 12 month period (provisional application window)

1b) If you have a full non-provisional patent or patent application you can license or sell that patent even if you don't have a product on the market yet

Full non-provisional patent means having enough information to create an actual product?

1c) You can file unlimited provisional patent applications until either you (or someone else) publicly discloses the invention or offers it for sale.  As long as you keep your idea secret, in theory you can keep re-filing provisional applications but this is risky because your competition may sneak a patent filing in and then at some point their patent will pre-date yours because each provisional application that you file will get its own filing date (you cannot link them together).

A few questions on the sentence "You can file unlimited provisional patent applications until either you (or someone else) publicly discloses the invention or offers it for sale"

1b1: An invention is publicly disclosed only if that idea is patented right?
1b2: Is it my responsibility to check the uniqueness of that idea before filing a provisional application ?

Thanks,
ideaboy

[Brad]

Hi,

1)  Once your provisional application expires there is not more out of pocket money.

1a)  I understand.  Yes, you can abandoned your patent application at anytime without any more expenses.

1b)  No.  Full non-provisional is just a type or category of patent application.  You can read more about this here:  https://patentfile.org/non-provisional-patent-application-vs-provisional-patent/

1b1)  No.  You can publicly disclose your invention in many different ways.  For example, posting a video on youtube or kickstarter would most likely be a full public disclosure.

1b2)  No.  That is what you are paying the patent office for.  You have to pay them a "search fee" and they will do a search for you.